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Evil, but cute & gay about it
...ramblings of the imperfectly innocent
Leather stuff (could possibly be TMI) 
21st-Nov-2006 10:12 pm
leather bear

My leather interests keep bouncing around in my head, and I'm not really sure of what I want my next steps to be. The "afraid I won't like it" thing is back a little, despite my amazing SF experience. Bah. Shall have to find some way of confronting that.

One next step I'm taking is attacking this like I do lots other problems: get lots of book knowledge to build a framework on which to hang experiences. I had been planning on getting SM 101 by Jay Wiseman, but a good friend gave me a copy (yay!). Several portions are *exactly* what I've been needing, and the rest seems very good, but I find it so poorly organized. The behavioral/psychological stuff is scattered throughout the physical how-to chapters, and I often want to go back to things that I can't find again. Anyone have particular recommendations/warnings for a budding bottom/submissive, especially on mental/emotional stuff or general interaction? Greenery Press has a lot of nice looking titles...

Also, is it OK/good to read top/dominant-oriented stuff, or is that a bit like RPG players reading the DM manual before the adventure?

Comments aren't screened, so feel free to email me if you want to not talk about this in front of the world....

22nd-Nov-2006 07:17 am (UTC)
It's still taking awhile to catch up on your journal. I'm up to like mid-July at the moment. I had no idea of your adventurous sex life. :) It's possible I still have you confused with someone else. Without pictures, it's hard to be sure. :(

Anyway, have you considered posting to something like gay_sex_tips or some other community? Could be the question has already been posted there too. Certainly not official information, but another source to ponder.
22nd-Nov-2006 07:28 am (UTC)
Adventurous sex life? Whose journal are you reading? No, if that stuff surprises you, you're probably thinking of the right person. I'll email you some pictures; I don't have a good one to use for an icon.

I should post this to some kink group, yes, but I am interested in personal recommendations. Thanks for the tip!
22nd-Nov-2006 07:37 am (UTC)
Sorry, don't read too much into that! I was being a bit flippant. Mostly referring to your SNF folks.

There is something in my brain that constantly wants to disassociate religious people with sex. I don't know what it is. I remember your conversations years ago (don't have them now) when you were having some rough times and going to some religious conventions and such. Ugh, sorry.

Hope that made sense.
22nd-Nov-2006 08:20 am (UTC)
No, I was just being flippant right back! :-}

Really, all this stuff is pretty new to me, and I'm in a very different place than I was before I moved here. I've moved past the rough times (mostly), and tried to put them behind me.

And, yeah, it does make sense. It's good to talk to you again!
22nd-Nov-2006 07:31 am (UTC)
You don't believe in LJ locks, eh?

So here's my take on the book knowledge thing: it's great to have a theoretical clue, but there's a lot more you will only figure out through experience. I could tell from offhand comments you made while you were here that you'd already read pretty extensively, and while I'd never say "stop reading", I think you may experience diminishing returns. A book can't tell you how you'll feel about any given thing or how the dynamic will play out in a given relationship. Written materials, especially Teh Online, also seem to have a certain force of homogenizing expectations that I don't find particularly useful.

I would suggest that you find a local group (Google pointed me at these guys, but I don't know if they're totally grotty or dying of no-members or anything: http://www.seattlemeninleather.org/ ), and go to the events. Go to brunch; go to classes and try things (or volunteer to be tried-upon) if you're comfortable with that. If you lived around here, I'd totally hook you up with the Santa Clara or Alameda County guys (both of whom are awesome), but alas I have no connections in your neck of the woods. You may ultimately decide that a club or public scene isn't your cup of tea, and that's fine, but it will give you the exposure to a variety of real-life people doing their thing in real-life ways. Even if you do not play with or near any of these people, there'll be helpful input IMO.

Specific warnings for the budding bottom: Relax. Remember that you always have the power to say no. Be present in your experiences. If something doesn't seem quite right to you emotionally, make the nice man slow down until you're sure it's OK. Communicate. Remember there are 2 people involved and your top isn't an appliance designed to give you your exact Perfect Fantasy Scene...but likewise do not be so generous as to take things you really don't want to take.

Oh, and as far as reading the topping materials goes, go for it. If anyone is actually using those books like a D&D manual they won't be much fun anyway! Hell, if in the course of events you want to try your hand at it, it doesn't mean you need to remodel your self-image. It's called *play* for a reason, y'know?

22nd-Nov-2006 07:52 am (UTC)
If there was some way of f-locking a post, but still make it be publicly accessible (so those who want to opt-out of my sexcapades could), that'd be awesome. Whenever I've asked LJ people, the answer has always been that there's no way to do that. And LJ cuts just suck, as I partially explained in my first LJ entry. *shrug* Suggestions for solving these problems are welcome!

Totally understand about the whole experience vs. reality thing, and I agree with you. That's why I went for the flogging in SF: at some point, I just have to do it. But (just like the first time I had sex) having that background meant I didn't have to spend any time/energy really processing the scene ("what does it mean?") and could just sit back and enjoy it. I was emotional enough with just the pleasure of getting flogged. Trying to deal with fear or confusion on top of that would have... diluted the experience.

Now I'm more focused on separating reality from porn-fueled fantasy. And don't let me fool you; I know a lot of things, and a lot of lingo, but there are some huge gaps. Some of them I don't even know the words for.

That's awesome advice. It's striking that balance that is central to my current uncertainties. I know what the party line is, but what's really real? That's where I am, if it makes sense.
22nd-Nov-2006 08:58 am (UTC)
f there was some way of f-locking a post, but still make it be publicly accessible (so those who want to opt-out of my sexcapades could)

I have people on my friends list who create separate journals or communities for things, that could be an option. I was mostly responding to the concern for anyone who wanted to reply without being seen by the public at large, though. ("Hey look, I just outed myself to my mom via Google! Hi Mom!")
(Deleted comment)
23rd-Nov-2006 07:49 am (UTC)
Yeah, but one of the things I really want is for random people who stumble across my blog to see that stuff, and just have friends who don't want to see it be shielded from it, and f-locking can't do that. It's OK; as I posted, I figured out a way around it.

I'll give you call this weekend; you've been on my mind a lot lately. Sorry for never posting in your journal...
22nd-Nov-2006 04:13 pm (UTC)
I liked The Bottoming Book and The Topping Book (course.. i *am* a switch..so). There was another one..It delved into some Psychology and some Experience..crap i can't remember the name, i'll have to check @ home sometime.

I'm all about more knowledge the better - if you have an idea of what the Top gets out of being a Top then you have a good idea of what you might want to look for in a Top. Do you want that that will build you up? tear you down? comfort you? scare you? hurt you? coddle you?

And if you don't like it you can always change different things. (like maybe you like smooth leather as opposed to suede leather...maybe rubber ends up suiting you.. maybe a more scary top, mebbe a less scary top - there's tons of variables).

And yep.. it *is* called "Play" for a reason ;)
23rd-Nov-2006 07:52 am (UTC)
Thanks for all the advice! Trying to get inside a Top's head sounds like a really good idea. I'll be sure to put those books at the top of my list.

22nd-Nov-2006 08:51 pm (UTC)

totally read the Bottoming *and* the Toppings books (in that order, too)

love them

some folks will certainly say bottoms shouldn't read or think about topping ness - i don't play with those folks :P

in fact, as a switch, i tend not to play with folks who've *never* switched. if my top has never yearned for the business end of a cane, i have a harder time relating to zir

as grrlie said, know what a top can get from a scene, helps very much when i'm giving
23rd-Nov-2006 07:56 am (UTC)
Cool! Glad to hear so many of my friends agreeing on those two titles. I still remember your other advice about the two groups of BSDM people (is therapy vs. not therapy), and how they just shouldn't play together. That always struck me as utterly sensible.

23rd-Nov-2006 09:39 am (UTC)
Heh, I think everyone agrees on the topping and bottoming books except for me. :) I really think I just have a personality conflict with the authors (I know I have much the same conflict w/ Dossie in person). Jason and I've also joked about rewriting "When Someone You Love Is Kinky" as a book that wouldn't, uh, terrify every single person we know.
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